What's you bidding plan

[richlp]

BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.

S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx

Is this a 2C opener for you?

Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C

1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????

What is your bidding plan?

[David Goldfarb]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

Opposite xxx xxxx xxx xxx, game is all but cold. If you can make game
opposite a 4333 Yarborough, I think you gotta open 2C. Opening 1C
and reversing into hearts isn't a terrible plan, though.

Post by richlp
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

3S. Partner should be able to read this as a splinter, and it's an
excellent description. If partner now bids 4D, I'll take control
with 4NT, but if partner bids 4H I will pass.

[rhm]

Post by David Goldfarb

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

Opposite xxx xxxx xxx xxx, game is all but cold. If you can make game
opposite a 4333 Yarborough, I think you gotta open 2C. Opening 1C
and reversing into hearts isn't a terrible plan, though.

Post by richlp
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

3S. Partner should be able to read this as a splinter, and it's an
excellent description. If partner now bids 4D, I'll take control
with 4NT, but if partner bids 4H I will pass.
--
David Goldfarb |"Just once I'd like to battle an alien menace
| Doctor Who: "Robot"
--

So you seriously expect a partner who has bid a heart suit headed by the ten at best and no control of clubs to make a forward going move over 3S?
Well I would not
If you open this hand 1C and receive a 1H response it is unrealistic to expect cooperation from an intelligent partner.
Simply bid 4NT and hope for the best.

[KWSchneider]

That's the point. It will make it obvious to him that anything resembling a control is relevant.

Kurt

[Kenny McCormack]

In article <ce12edc9-6af4-47d7-af2e-***@googlegroups.com>,
rhm <***@softwareag.com> wrote:
...

Post by rhm
If you open this hand 1C and receive a 1H response it is unrealistic to expect
cooperation from an intelligent partner.
Simply bid 4NT and hope for the best.

Playing online (the stated conditions), you just bid 6H and hope for the best.

Note that if you bid 4N and get some response, you will have no idea what
the response means (without using the "chat window" to ask pd what form of
BW he favors) - given the wide variety of BW response systems out there.

[Adam Lea]

Post by rhm

Post by David Goldfarb

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

Opposite xxx xxxx xxx xxx, game is all but cold. If you can make game
opposite a 4333 Yarborough, I think you gotta open 2C. Opening 1C
and reversing into hearts isn't a terrible plan, though.

Post by richlp
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

3S. Partner should be able to read this as a splinter, and it's an
excellent description. If partner now bids 4D, I'll take control
with 4NT, but if partner bids 4H I will pass.
--
David Goldfarb |"Just once I'd like to battle an alien menace
| Doctor Who: "Robot"
--

So you seriously expect a partner who has bid a heart suit headed by the ten at best and no control of clubs to make a forward going move over 3S?
Well I would not
If you open this hand 1C and receive a 1H response it is unrealistic to expect cooperation from an intelligent partner.
Simply bid 4NT and hope for the best.

With certain hands yes. There is no rule that partner has to have an
absolute minimum with no control. There are 21 HCP between the other
three hands, why can't partner have 7-10 of those? Would you not
co-operate in slam investigation by cue bidding 4D if you held something
like KQxx Txxxx Axx x which is one of the most mis-fitting single HCP
count hand I can think of right now consistent with the auction where
slam is good?

[KWSchneider]

3S

[p***@infi.net]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

4NT, bid slam unless zero Aces. I doubt I could get any partner to cooperate with the poor trumps he's looking at, so no point in trying for science.

[Player]

Opposite a random bboer 3s is crazy. I bid 6h. Opposite a reg partner 3s is obvious.

[Player]

4nt is silly Paul. If pd shows 1 bullet does this mean you dont have 2 diamond losers? You may as well bid 6h and hope for a lucky lead.

[p***@infi.net]

Post by Player
4nt is silly Paul. If pd shows 1 bullet does this mean you dont have 2 diamond losers? You may as well bid 6h and hope for a lucky lead.

6H is silly IMO if partner has no Aces.

[Lorne Anderson]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

3S. If partner does not realise this is a splinter what is the point of
playing these games ?

I agree with 1C.

[jogs]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

Anecdotal, no proof, my experience has been at the advance level, when one team bids slam and the other doesn't, the team in the lower level contract usually wins the board.

[Travis Crump]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

Not sure about playing with a random, but am curious as to why no one
has suggested a 4C rebid. If it is not this hand, what is the defect
that stops you? There is an argument that partner will be misled because
he can't have help for you suits, but the same problem mostly exists
with 3S. You always have a singleton when you are 4-6 so it can't just
be that.

[David Goldfarb]

Post by Travis Crump

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx

Not sure about playing with a random, but am curious as to why no one
has suggested a 4C rebid. If it is not this hand, what is the defect
that stops you?

A random partner on BBO won't understand the meaning of the bid.

[Kenny McCormack]

Post by David Goldfarb

Post by Travis Crump

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx

Not sure about playing with a random, but am curious as to why no one
has suggested a 4C rebid. If it is not this hand, what is the defect
that stops you?

A random partner on BBO won't understand the meaning of the bid.

Or pretty much anything else.

Also, keep in mind that pd's opinion of you isn't going to be any better
than your opinion of him.

Note that that last comment also applies pretty well to the act of posting
on Usenet as well.

[Steve Willner]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

I wouldn't open 2C with a regular partner. Do I expect to beat 4S or
even 5S if opponents bid one of those?

I don't have any experience on BBO, but with no system discussion,
bidding 2C strikes me as less attractive than with a regular partner.

After 1C-1H, I agree with 4NT if random partner will understand it as
some kind of Blackwood. Can you count on that?

[Player]

Post by Steve Willner

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

I wouldn't open 2C with a regular partner. Do I expect to beat 4S or
even 5S if opponents bid one of those?
I don't have any experience on BBO, but with no system discussion,
bidding 2C strikes me as less attractive than with a regular partner.
After 1C-1H, I agree with 4NT if random partner will understand it as
some kind of Blackwood. Can you count on that?

Your random pd will understand it as B'wood. However how are you guarding against 2 diamond losers?
With a regular pd 3S, or even better 4C is the best bid. As I said, with a random I bid 6H and hope for a favourable lead.

[Dave Flower]

Post by Player

Post by Steve Willner

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

I wouldn't open 2C with a regular partner. Do I expect to beat 4S or
even 5S if opponents bid one of those?
I don't have any experience on BBO, but with no system discussion,
bidding 2C strikes me as less attractive than with a regular partner.
After 1C-1H, I agree with 4NT if random partner will understand it as
some kind of Blackwood. Can you count on that?

Your random pd will understand it as B'wood. However how are you guarding against 2 diamond losers?
With a regular pd 3S, or even better 4C is the best bid. As I said, with a random I bid 6H and hope for a favourable lead.

Even if you have two top diamond losers, you may well not lose them!

Dave Flower

[p***@infi.net]

Post by Player

Post by Steve Willner

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?

I wouldn't open 2C with a regular partner. Do I expect to beat 4S or
even 5S if opponents bid one of those?
I don't have any experience on BBO, but with no system discussion,
bidding 2C strikes me as less attractive than with a regular partner.
After 1C-1H, I agree with 4NT if random partner will understand it as
some kind of Blackwood. Can you count on that?

Your random pd will understand it as B'wood. However how are you guarding against 2 diamond losers?
With a regular pd 3S, or even better 4C is the best bid. As I said, with a random I bid 6H and hope for a favourable lead.

What favorable lead do you expect if partner happens to have zero Aces? A club? A trump? I think you will make 6H opposite zero Aces once in a blue moon. But if partner has one Ace it will be the Ace of diamonds roughly half the time, and he will either have a diamond control or you will receive a different lead some percentage of the time, so the odds of not losing the first two tricks look very good. The ability to pull trumps rapidly, run the clubs and take discards makes it likely we can win 12 tricks if we don't lose the first two. So many players seem to have an ingrained aversion to 4NT with a doubleton or void they fail to think. And as I said in my first post, I doubt I can get a scientific answer from any of my partners, let alone a random one, given their poor trumps.

[Dave Flower]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

Consider the following sequence:

1C pass 1H pass
4NT pass 5D pass
6H all pass

Nobody has commented on a significant bid on this sequence: RHO's pass of 5D.
With many hands that would lead a diamond against 6H, RHO would double, so the prospect of not losing two diamonds is bright.

Incidentally, if 5D is doubled, and the next two hands pass, would redouble show the diamond ace ??

Dave Flower

[Player]

I am curious Dave. Do you often x to remind yourself what to lead?

[Dave Flower]

Post by Player
I am curious Dave. Do you often x to remind yourself what to lead?

At that point in the bidding, RHO doesn't know whether the final contract will be in clubs, hearts or NT. It would be embarrassing to hold DAK and see 6NT make!

Dave Flower

[Player]

Post by Dave Flower

Post by Player
I am curious Dave. Do you often x to remind yourself what to lead?

At that point in the bidding, RHO doesn't know whether the final contract will be in clubs, hearts or NT. It would be embarrassing to hold DAK and see 6NT make!
Dave Flower

Unless you are playing total Rubes, the 4NT bid agrees H and is KC in that suit.

[richlp]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

Thanks for all the responses.

FWIW.............

At the table I was certain 3S and 4C had almost zero chance of being understood. I also couldn't see 12 tricks opposite no Aces and I couldn't imagine that, even if we could scramble 12 tricks the opponents would cash their two first.

So I bid 4NT - confident that it would be Blackwood and (with KQ of hearts) not caring if s/he thought it was RKCB or not.

Partner showed 1 Ace. If it's the diamond Ace we're probably golden. If it's the Spade Ace they may not cash two diamonds.

Opening leader had something like
KQTxx
xxx
xx
Jxx

and led a diamond. DOWN ONE.

[Player]

Not surprising. It shows how silly 4nt is.

[richlp]

Post by Player
Not surprising. It shows how silly 4nt is.

Would you have found the diamond lead on my auction?

How do the two auctions (I bid 4NT, you bid 6H) differ such that a different opening lead is selected?

[Player]

Post by richlp

Post by Player
Not surprising. It shows how silly 4nt is.

Would you have found the diamond lead on my auction?
How do the two auctions (I bid 4NT, you bid 6H) differ such that a different opening lead is selected?

If you read my previous posts you would see that I advocated 3S or 4C (on reflection 4C is far superior to 3S), with a regular partner. 4NT is silly; it is no better than 6H. Note that you may still make 6H even if missing 2 bullets on certain layouts if a C or trump is led. No I doubt I would have found the D lead. So what?
A further disadvantage of 4NT is that it might give Dave Flower a chance to double a D response so he could remind himself what to lead.

[smn]

Post by richlp
BBO - Usual conditions (Random partner, no system discussion)
IMPS. First Seat.
S: x
H: AKQJ
D: xx
C: AKQTxx
Is this a 2C opener for you?
Lots of tricks and lots of HCP, but the long suit is a minor and the opponents might prevent you from showing both suits. For me it was 1C
1C (pass) 1H (pass)
????
What is your bidding plan?

9tricks ,4 losers ,good shape ; 2c for me . I don't want to play 1c .With 6-5 or 5-5 I worry more about 2c then 6-4 . smn

[Player]

Holding this hand you will NEVER play 1c. Please construct a hand where 1c would be passed out.